Adventure & Activity Marketing Pros - The Podcast

AAMP Happy Hour- Drinks and Good Conversation With Andy From Seaforth Boat Rentals

February 01, 2021 AAMP Agency Episode 6
Adventure & Activity Marketing Pros - The Podcast
AAMP Happy Hour- Drinks and Good Conversation With Andy From Seaforth Boat Rentals
Chapters
Adventure & Activity Marketing Pros - The Podcast
AAMP Happy Hour- Drinks and Good Conversation With Andy From Seaforth Boat Rentals
Feb 01, 2021 Episode 6
AAMP Agency

After a long day in the tourism and adventure marketing business, nothing beats sitting down and having a drink with our friend and long term client Andy Kurtz from Seaforth Boat and Jetski Rentals in San Diego.  We hung out at Seaforth Mission Bay and found out about the 40 year+ history of Seaforth starting back with Andy’s dad in 1978.  How he has learned to adapt and expand in an industry that he loves and advocates for and how he would sooner be spending his free time on a boat.  We also got real about the effects of the Corona Virus and how he adapted and had a spectacular year and what steps he is prepping for coming into the 2021 season.  Plus we were able to talk some crap and have some laughs.  So check out Seaforth at http://seaforthboatrentals.com/ and of course let us know in the comments or hit us up at hey@aamp.agency


Show Notes Transcript

After a long day in the tourism and adventure marketing business, nothing beats sitting down and having a drink with our friend and long term client Andy Kurtz from Seaforth Boat and Jetski Rentals in San Diego.  We hung out at Seaforth Mission Bay and found out about the 40 year+ history of Seaforth starting back with Andy’s dad in 1978.  How he has learned to adapt and expand in an industry that he loves and advocates for and how he would sooner be spending his free time on a boat.  We also got real about the effects of the Corona Virus and how he adapted and had a spectacular year and what steps he is prepping for coming into the 2021 season.  Plus we were able to talk some crap and have some laughs.  So check out Seaforth at http://seaforthboatrentals.com/ and of course let us know in the comments or hit us up at hey@aamp.agency


Unknown:

321 Welcome everybody to the AMP podcast adventure and activity marketing pros. My name is Jayden. And yeah, we are on the road in sunny San Diego still and we decided to take the podcast on the road and bringing some tour operators down here. And we got Steve Brian and welcome to the show. Andy from Seaforth boat rentals, we made it down the street, which is exciting. Perfect. This is a good time. This is a happy hour time I would say it's end of day we've I think we're all drinking a beer right now. So we've talked a lot of tourism today. So it's nice to come and kick it with Andy. Andy is I'll say my most laid back. Chill tour operator. Wow. I mean, I take that as a compliment. Actually, that's not something I attribute as quality. I need to be a little bit more of a heart So okay, maybe chill is the wrong word. I think it's uh, I can have some pretty real conversations with you. We can talk shop. We know what the agenda is. But the end of the day you enjoy a drink to get the day done. Absolutely. That part I like. So I apologize if you're serious businessman. serious business. Yes. And this is we're in the boat rental business. So it's serious business. We are in the fun business are in the fun. But business is still business. It is okay. How was business? This year? last year. Last year, it's talk this past summer was crazy. So the beginning of the summer, we had a little bit of an issue with some health things going on. I don't know what I'm talking about. Well, you know, I mean, there was there were some things going on. Right, okay. And world, or was that just it wasn't local to San Diego, I think was pretty much worldwide. And so I'm sitting there having a conversation with my wife while I am not working sitting at home. And I'm like, What do you think about living in a trailer in Tijuana? Because I don't know that we're actually going to be able to survive this. And she's like, the most amazing woman in the world. She's like, that's cool. Whatever it takes, we'll do it. And I'm slightly exaggerating, but not much like we started out pretty bleak and not knowing that we're gonna survive her. Sure. And we ended up the year, we ended up 20 with the highest grossing year we've ever had. That didn't translate out of the bottom bottom line. But more money came across the table this year than we've ever had, which is phenomenal. Yeah, to say it was a crushing year is I think everybody was a little bit surprised by that. Nobody really anticipated the summer to look like how the summer did. I'm a little shocked that your answer is to go live in Tijuana. Because the fuck wants to go live in Tijuana. Who doesn't like tortillas and and tequila and Pacifica? I mean, I mean, where else you're gonna go. Everybody likes that. But man, I mean, if you're gonna move to Mexico, a little bit further. Well, actually, the plan really was to move to Puerto Vallarta because I have friends. I have places down there. But I didn't want to let that out because they didn't know that we were gonna go squat on their place of porta viar. Toe if it was just a matter of what you could throw in the suburbs. I felt like he could have probably moved a little bit further. It's a figure of speech. It was not a literal plan. Like I wasn't scoping out campsites in Tijuana. What do they do they speak to that. Do they even have campsites and Tina one you know. And to me, I that is outside the area of my expertise. I do a lot of people camp down there. Yeah. So yeah. It's probably not a national camping though. Right. More your urban camp? Yes. Is that I mean, there's a lot of urban campers around here too. There are. There are I actually was gonna turn. I was planning on on starting a magazine at some point, which was sort of the urban camper campers weekly, which was, you know, featuring different people that hang out in the corners and stuff. But I found that was very politically incorrect. You could do a podcast with him. Oh, absolutely. There we talk about what brought him to San Diego. Yeah, yeah, I like it. So okay, so that that was a great intro there. We just went into all the Tijuana stuff. So Andy, tell us a little bit about what you guys do at Seaforth because you guys have multiple locations here. I mean, we've worked with you guys. You guys do jet skis. sailboats, powerboats, a little bit everything. Tell us a little bit, give us your overview. So I'm pretty proud to say that we are the only company that does everything that we do so there's a lot of companies that rent jet skis. There's a lot of companies that does yacht charters and kayaks, but nobody does. Everything that we do we have it all under one roof and that is tours, sale tours, power tours, jetski tours, we do kayak rentals, fishing boat rentals, we do powerboat and sailboats, we do yachts, pretty much anything that floats, we do. And that's also presented its own share of problems because you are in a bunch of locations as well. Right? I'm doing everything obviously means that there's a lot of moving parts. There are a lot of moving parts. What's your what's your staff, full, full time staff? What did you have in the summer peak season? Tell us a little bit we were right around 50 full time employees in the summer. And that's where I try and max out because you know, there's all kinds of regulations when you go over 50, sir, but yeah, pretty close to 50. And people were working lots of hours is crazy. That's I mean, knowing what we went through this summer, the fact that you know, you and I have talked shop a little bit the fact that you were able to come out of this, I mean, and not just you but people in the watersports and adventure business. Nobody could have anticipated in March what the summer looked like. Right. And I mean, I think, I think that says a lot. I think it says a lot to people's desire to, you know, get outdoors get away from what happened. And it really made a lot of operators step their game up. You know, you think I look at your guys's website, and you guys should go check it out. It's new. It's beautiful. It's probably one of the nicest websites that we've ever created. And it's a fucking behemoth god, there's a lot of shit on there is there is and actually it's funny because through like July when things were really ramping up, I was pretty sure it was that the fact that we had switched to you guys to do our marketing, there was actually reason that it was blowing up. I found out that everybody else in the any related business was killing it as well. So I stopped patting myself on the back and I stopped thinking, yeah, pretty much but so that's fun for a while fun little story about that. When I was talking with Andy, when we first met last year, he said, I think I bet on the wrong horse Jaden. That's what he That's what he said when we were talking because we he said he's these talk with agencies that talk the talk and walk the walk. But then he's like, I bet man, and I just feel like I bet on the wrong horse. I did. And actually, the story, the way I ended up with you guys is that we were with one tour operator, and we had to redo the website because they had built that our website. So I, our new, our new reservation system recommended a bunch of different people, including you guys. And I did some interviews, and it was down to somebody that was not on the list, a local guy, and you guys, and I met with the local guy. And he gave me this great big song and dance and analytics and all kinds of magic. And, you know, with you guys, I got a bunch of bows. And you know, I think these guys are on crack, but that's not true. Never smoke crack. Anyway, so I made a decision, you know, I consulted with with my staff, and and we we went another direction. And we got into, we got what, like six months into that contract. And I was really disappointed with the results. And I think one of my key parts of success is to recognize a mistake, admit a mistake and fix a mistake. And that's why I went back and I called and I did I said hey, I have a magical moment right there. Wow, that was just magical. We're gonna take that as a magical review. I mean, this is like, this is the kind of review you try to buy. So I'll slip use a 20 when we're done. And I didn't mean to interrupt you that great review story there with the magical unicorn. Yeah. And that was that, like you said, Yeah, I mean, it was just one of those things where we we talked, we had a relationship. I mean, you and Steve talked on the phone for a long, long time almost every day about stuff and when we grew we helped you know growing your business to then when when we first interviewed you when we hung up I'm like, it's gonna be a fucking pain in the butt. I still am not that chill guy. when when when we were pitching you and hearing what you have, like, you know, when you're going up to bat against another agency in your hearing what this other agency like that's, that's fucking bullshit. That's not real. I was like, Andy is gonna be a pain in the ass. And to be honest, it's been a pretty fantastic work. I will say that we made that. Yeah, we fix that mistake. I'm happy you did as well. This has been a pretty pretty fun relationship going back and forth. But um, so you know, I guess we ask everybody this. This is a happy hour. So it's not supposed to be serious. But your guy from Rhode Island. How are you renting? Shit in San Diego? First of all, Maryland, Maryland. My bad Sorry, my sister's from Rhode Island big thing we don't want to talk about all right. But anyway, how did I so we I moved here when I came, I went here to go to college my parents had we're here came here to go to college, and was in business with my parents for a long time and my dad knew nothing about boats and nothing about business is kind of a funny story. So he relied on my knowledge of boats and my learned what I learned in school about business and ended up buying them out and and taking it over and certainly have grown. How long ago was that? I mean, Seaforth in his family business how when it started, we were we started in 1976. So it goes back a couple years. So this isn't your first day by any No, no, I I've made many mistakes over the years. So starting out of yours, starting out How big was your guys's fleet, it was one location and about 20 vessels, and were four locations and about almost 200 boats right now. So how does one even get the 20 boats though? I mean, that's even a one. So the 20 boats was it was an existing business. Okay, 20 vessels, my dad borrowed money from his mother in law and bought a business that was totally failing, and was able to put in enough work to keep it above water until I could make it a real success. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. So you acquired acquired existing business? Yes. Okay. And then what year was that? That was in 1976. Okay. Yeah. So been doing it for a minute. Again, the only problem is your math when you tell me you're 29 nine. I always tell you, I've been doing it about 30 years, which is a shitload of years. But if you do the math, it's actually a little bit longer than goes longer. Right. Right. Right. I mean, so. You started before I was born. Yeah. I'm sure that's true. That I was born in 80. So yeah, yeah. And I feel old. So yeah, imagine how I congratulate. But fortunately, you know, being in business doesn't make you old. It doesn't give you a you know, a live Yeah, yeah. I think it keeps you alive. I think that, you know, what I love about what we do, and working with tour operators is, you know, we work with, in the past, I've worked with dental operators and chiropractors and shit like that. And it sucks. Yeah, it's not fun. At least everyday, you're waking up. And most of your customers are doing business with you. Because they're here to have fun. That's what makes it worthwhile. That's the only reason. I mean, I could do anything. I mean, I could you can sell, you can sell, it doesn't matter. But what we're selling really is fun. And that's something that I try and emphasize with my staff all the time. We're not running boats, we're running an experience. That's huge. Yeah, people aren't coming to San Diego. That's true, though. Right? Experience renting an experience and a lot of people when they make their business model that way. It's true. I also think, you know, when you think that you've been doing this, you know, 40 years now 43 years? Yeah. 43 years, you kind of have to love what the fuck you do? Or are just so scared of doing something else. That's all you can do. So have you ever had any other side? jobs? Yeah. So I graduated from college with a degree in manufacturing, management, Business Management with an emphasis of manufacturing. And I love fixing things and building things. And I got a job at a at a computer company in their manufacturing plant. So I went to work there. And every day I'm working on the factory floor, which I wasn't supposed to but I'd go out there and do all this. And one day, he was always first their last, you know, I had that entrepreneurial thing. So I'm leaving and I'm walking out in my boss's boss is there and he's getting into like an old piece of shit Nova, right. And I'm looking at that and I'm like, wait, this is two levels up. And if this is what I aspire to go to levels up and drive in a piece of shit no, but like this just doesn't work. So I decided to go back and help my parents and try and build the business and and that was how I ended up working with families and that fun I know that is no fun at all. Although I do say my daughter is an integral part of the business and she's fantastic. She is fantastic. So and my kids have all worked here over the years my wife helps out in different ways. So we don't other than my daughter we don't work together on a daily basis but family and business is your grandma your grandpa now I am a grandpa now. Yeah, yeah, Zara girl, little boy, boy is that first grandkid. First grandpa. Yeah, what's his name is Carter Carter. So in the bigger picture is the grand scheme to keep us in the family. Your daughter wants us, you know? Yes, I think she does. And then I also am very fortunate in some of our other key players are the son of a guy that I went to kindergarten with. So we it's it's, there's a lot of people that I would love to say we'll stay involved over the long run and I can just get a check every month but let's let's talk a little bit about that like because you mentioned we're in this Marina here we're in mission mission Mission Bay Mission Bay. Okay. You You played some politics it kind of in this in this sea, the sailing world kinda don't you kind of have to. Absolutely. And you deal with the port, you deal with the city you deal with the city of cornado you deal with? You got to play all kinds of different people that are we are regulated by so many different government agencies that we have the whole alphabet. Yeah, we deal with. And honestly, when we kind of first met when we talked to people around here, everybody knew who you were. I mean, everybody came in. And that's kind of the thing. We know, Andy and he's part of our club are part of this part of that. Right? It seems like there is, you know, us not being in here. But I mean, there's some totally some some good old boys around the marinas around here. Yeah. Well, there's a businessman, that's a Andy's a good old boy. is one of the little boys, though I prefer to be an asshole. Like, that's way easier to deal with. But no, there we are. We have the doc masters group, we have the port tenants Association. Yeah, I think that an important part of business is knowing what's over the horizon. And the only way you know what's coming at you is by having access to as many sources as you possibly can. And that's by joining groups and being part of things. And that proves I think like the Titan you got to do stuff kind of to get it doesn't take can't just be one operator coming out here and you know, doing your own Right, right. Right. So I'm actually more curious on the business side, you've been doing this for, I mean, even by a horrible math 43 years, and unless you started with your one will have puts you a couple years older than 43. Yeah. Do you ever see yourself retiring? I don't think so. I don't think so. I mean, why, yeah, I mean, I have friends that are retired, and they are constantly looking for what their next adventure is. I mean, I have an adventure every day, whether it's somebody locking themselves in their bathroom and lighting it on fire, or whether it's a boat sinking, or you know, I have plenty of adventure. And some of it's fun. Like, you gotta have something that keeps it real, I think when you retire is when you die. Yeah. And my dad, you know, my dad did 20 years military 20 years, man, you know, after that, and my dad comes to the office, I don't want to say every day, but three to four days a week. There might not be shit to do, but it's to tinker. And he's in the back messing with scooters and boats and jet skis, Jeeps. And I mean, he'll help with whatever you ask for. And, you know, I just Yeah, you got to do something. Right. Right. Oh, that's cool. For sure. So we're looking for those you know, it is happy hour a little bit and I mean, not to put you on the spot. But I mean, is there what's, what's the craziest experience you've you've seen kind of through all your years, being a boat rental operator. I you know, there's a book for sure, that could be written. But one of my highlights. What's the story? You tell your buddies when they're like talking shop, and you're like, so this happened? Most recently, rather than recently, this one, I'm sitting in the back office. And they come in, they say there's a guy locked in the bathroom. I'm like, Okay, I'm like, why don't you get him out of the bathroom? So they're like, Yeah, he's got, he's got weapons and this and that. So I go, I go, and I go knock on the door, the bathroom. I'm like, oh, excuse me, sir. But you have to leave. Okay, it might have been worded slightly different than that. It was sort of the gist of it. Right. And so he yelled, you know, some profanity laced things. And there's a huge puff of white cloud was the fire extinguisher that he fired underneath the door. So I was pretty sure that guy wasn't leaving. So we're going back and forth. And then he decides that he's going to leave. But then I got people in the office, I got employees and he's yelling and ranting, so we blocked the door to the bathroom and lock them in and call the police and, and so the police are coming. This is crazy. So the police are coming and then they we smell smoke. Oh, so apparently the guy decided he was gonna smoke his way out. There's smoke billowing out through the vents and all this. So we said I tell him guys call the fire department. So it ended up he lit a trashcan on fire. And he went Oh, that's awesome day. But yeah, that the people in the office get their vote wrong. Of course they did. And you know what, you know what? That's a really funny point. So we had all these reservations and people are showing up. So I tell our phone system can be can be transferred to a software to a cell phone. So I had my office people on the cell phone outside doing the contracts. I'm like, we are not stopping this keeps going. Yeah, we're not there's no hurry. Movies ones you go out? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Awesome. That's awesome. What is, you know, 43 years of doing business? If you were giving advice, somebody is going to go into this, the one piece one hard token, don't do this or do this, or how do you be successful? Wow, how to be successful, you be successful by keeping your perspective that you are selling fun. So just make sure that your attitude is fun, that your employees are fun, that your rules are not onerous beyond what needs to be safe. So I see all these places you go to, you know, you go to the go kart guy, and they're, you know, so serious, you know, put your helmet on put this, your you go there for fun, you don't want people dictate, you know, you got to follow the rules, rules are one thing, but make sure that it's that you're having a good time. And if my employees are happy, and I'm happy and the music is good, then you will be successful in this business. I find that a lot that guys get jaded, right? You know, it takes one broken jetski run boat driven up on a shore, you know, one accident, right? And all of a sudden your rules, regulations. So this year was our first year doing jet skis. And you and I've talked right many times about that. And I think it's one of those businesses that you can get all the advice in the world. But until you actually rent a jetski out, and you see the shit that goes with it. I mean, I bought brand new jet skis, as we do every year. And like day, two of the first batch this year, a guy comes back with a huge hole in the side of the jetski. And he's like, I didn't do it. I'm like, What the fuck? Did you know that what he did was really hard water. And, you know, I mean, I'm still fighting with the guy will I get paid from that so you can so that could ruin my day could ruin every time I'm renting a jetski. But I say, hey, nobody got hurt. It wasn't a big deal. We'll we'll make it up over the long run. It is what it is. So you can't get so tied up in the things that you can't do anything about. I also think that this is such an industry that, you know, you went to school, you got a degree in something, or tour operator owners have degrees like that, yeah, big degrees, real degrees. Yeah. way smarter than I thought. If I were all that smart, we wouldn't be in the book business. I'm telling you that. But some of this is like there's no good handbook to being a tour operator being in the rental business for sure. You definitely just have to stick your I mean, I use the term, stick your dick out a little bit, and wait till it gets slapped. Right. That's kind of what happens, you've got to adjust to this. You do and you learn as you go. There's no doubt about it. But that's probably true in most businesses, you know, if you're going to be successful, then you have to be the one that's going to innovate. And if you're figuring out the new stuff, then you're also the one that first the first one that finds the problems and the and the perils of that. I mean, I pride myself that I say most of the stuff that we do in San Diego anyway, we were the first people to do it. Like I it's a bold statement, but nobody did like sunset sales before we did it. Now I stole that idea because I went to Hawaii, and they're like sunset sales. I'm like, shit, our boats are tied up at night. So we did it and then all my competitors do it. So many things that we did. So you always have to be looking at what you can do that's different and expect other people to copy. What do you think as you've been doing this for as long as you have? Would you stop saying that for God's that's the part I love because I feel like, you know, I don't want to call you dad. I'm not gonna call you dad. That's good. We're not quite there yet. But I feel like I when I come and I talk to you, or you and I talk on the phone, you know, I care about your marketing and I care about your guys's business. And but I'm I'm kind of like a noob right. We're doing Jeep rentals. And that's fairly easy. It's fairly on abrasive. I'm not dying from it. Right. But man I have this year kicked my ass with jet skis. And don't get me wrong. We made money. It was good year, right, but I left you know, September October and the only thing I could say was fuck. Oh, yeah, that was a lot. Yeah. And you know, so my conversations with you. A lot of times are almost seeking knowledge you know, I'm taking what advice you're giving as almost like a vacuum of Okay, this is if Andy says is the direction and he's done this long enough. I trust Andy's judgment, and good, bad or indifferent. I mean, it's a learning curve as we go. And that's the part I'm you know, I applaud you. But I also wonder where does it go from here? your guys's relationship. You want to go steady because I'm a little uncomfortable with that. Am I invited on vacation? Where Where does the company go from here? We are going to, we will continue to grow. I am not looking so much to move outside of this geographic area. I think managing locations is hard enough when you can drive to it every day to think that I gotta take the day to drive, there's not good. I think that the market is in our expansion market is in more tours. So a substantial part of what we do are things that people do themselves, you know, they'll drive the boat themselves. They even even our tours that we do, are pretty much private tours. But if you look at at what is available people, how many people go to the zoo, how many people go to SeaWorld, all of those people are looking for something else to do see what day the zoos a day 1000s of people every day 10s of 1000s all of those people are my marketing that we're not necessarily Yeah, hundreds of 1000s. So I need to sell to those people, I need a product that will work for people that don't want to do they just want to sit in a seat and have somebody do that. And that's not what we are doing real well right now. I mean, we do it. Well, we just don't have a huge offering there. So that's where we're gonna focus this year. Yeah, you're a rental operator first. And now we're starting on, you know, are really trying to wrap our head around the tour bus Exactly. Provide experiences and experiences for people at all levels. So a super safe, easy to do activity for people that are not adventurous enough to want to do it themselves that they want somebody to hold their Well, let's talk about that. Because I know you did try some things actually before COVID you know what I mean? You were doing some more experiences, right? with the, with the sailing, and you realize that there was a market for you know, like that instagrammable cruise, you know what I mean for you to get there. Right, right talk talk some of your successes, and maybe some of your failures on those are what do you think you saw worked. And so we tried the Groupon thing when Groupon first came out, right, and and you could sell anything on Groupon. So now, again, one of my better ideas that I stole from somebody else, I was in Key West. And there's a company down there that I think does a wonderful job, and they were selling jetski tours. And I'm lined up and I see you know, we were I was just gonna rent a boat, but I see these people lined up around the block to do the jetski tours. I'm like, we can do that. Yeah, so we sold groupons and we did a ton of jetski tours, like we sold them, they were crazy. But we also had some challenges there too, because it's Key West, the waters a little bit different than it is here. You know, we had a guy that almost ended up in the surf and this and that, but so that that that was a you know, that was a great business that we will probably venture back into now that we're when we're over with the COVID restrictions. Yeah, Groupon is like the only otas that I think ends up making sense on the local tour type stuff. You know, we've talked out to you guys and some of that. I just think you know, the Groupon while you're discounting and you're giving away the farm to do it right effectively, it does make bookings it does it does I'm actually super anti Groupon now for a couple of reasons. One is that they used to get the breakage so if I sold 1000 and only 500 got redeemed I made 1000 you still got the 1000 so you could afford to do that big discount and then they also their their policies got to be ridiculous. Yeah, they are they're so they they're their day has come and gone but that was a great thing when it first came out and we always talk about that to like in local markets with something like Yelp and Groupon right and the tourism space and we we understand because in this could even go back to even the COVID boom that San Diego had his locals in market were looking for things to do. Right, right. You know what I mean? And that's different than the traveler tourism that's bringing their family from the Midwest to come to SeaWorld to experience San Diego right. Those are two different marketing strategies, aren't they? Absolutely Yeah. And when you even say local so California being the beast that it is it you know, I would even consider a local somebody who's from like la Oh no, our locals are actually la Arizona Vegas and even Texas because there's a huge contingent of people are sure that when Texas is pretty much uninhabitable in the summer so they come here every summer so that those are locals would be the people that we expect to see every year and we didn't see we talked about that on the way down I mean, a day trip for or weekend trips you drive down yeah, so for Arizona and all that they are and that's honestly a key point that I think some tour operators have to look at their marketing if not just looking for local the city you're in that you're offering the tour, right you know what I mean? What is the surrounding four states, regions, etc. They don't. I'll tell you a Groupon story. So we did real well with the first round of groupons right was a year one with Groupon. We killed it. The second year. I tried it and it was less you know, Work ever again. I was the innovator, everybody else is selling it. And I convinced Groupon we were the first people that they would sell out of market. So I got them to sell our Groupon on their direct mail to people from LA and Arizona. And we got this huge second bite of the apple because we were the only ones marketing that same product at a market. And they did it. Yeah, cuz How was Phoenix four hours from here? Yeah. And those people they're coming and they're looking for things to do in San Diego percent. It actually is probably faster to drive from Phoenix to here than it is from LA probably. Especially during traffic. I bet it is. Yeah. I mean, that that is that is so true. I mean, a drive to LA from here sucks. All the traffic congestion sucks. I hate Oh, man. That's my rant of the day. I hate the California. Well, we didn't we haven't had traffic. We haven't had traffic since March. Traffic has stopped people are not going into the office. I mean, I used to take me that's I mean, it's nothing I we can my daughter lives in the East County, which is like the worst freeway. And we wouldn't go between like three and six because the traffic is so bad. He can go 530 no problem right now. There's nothing on the freeway. Probably at this point. You're probably loving San Diego, you're just right. Oh, it's like San Diego of 20 years ago. I mean, the traffic is is like 20 years ago. You have to be you have to be over if not being able to go into a restaurant though. Oh, I am so over that. I am so over that. So what is your favorite place to eat in San Diego? You that's so funny. You say that my wife and I we go out to eat pretty much every night. Okay, we she's a great cook, but we still go out every night. And we were talking last night like where do you want to go? And so there's a there's two places that are the top of the list. One is a kind of an Italian place in La Jolla Shores called barbarella. Fantastic. And they have cauliflower pizza, which is I love cauliflower crust pizza. This is a phenomenal place. So barbarella is the one and then there's el Ranchero which is my favorite Mexican place. It's also in La Jolla and it is nominal. So of those two if we're going to some I mean, we're going somewhere to eat tonight. Which one are we going to Oh, you are going to Ranchero because they have a great bar bunch of tequila and beers. Perfect. You made it sound like that's 2019 Ranchero though is is there a great bohart and great tequila or do we have to sit outside? Oh, no, no, you're sitting outside. They're sitting outside. So I gotta bring my mittens. Yeah, yeah. My mittens my Bernie Sanders. told me about that that like current topic, Andy? Yeah, follow memes. Oh, absolutely. You see that? Bernie Sanders? I did see that Bernie, so I'm kind of addicted to Reddit. Okay. I've seen I've seen a few Bernie Sanders memes here. I'd love to see what your subreddits you know, I wouldn't share that with you. I know. Like, Oh, shit. Like, that's way too revealing. Like I would if I had a shrink. I wouldn't tell him what No, no, no, nobody can share this. So the best part about the Bernie Sanders thing is my wife and I are watching the inauguration. Yeah. And there's Bernie and I'm like, What is going on? He's got his mail. He's got the check. He's got a deposit. Like what is the post office? Those meme those memes were probably the funniest thing we we threw a little Bernie on on some of the stuff we our creative team was doing. Yeah, different memes. And you have to be in the moment to about that, right? I mean, he can't be 10 years behind it. I mean, you're saying like even when this podcast gets released, we're gonna be a little bit behind. I think that's so funny though. The the Bernie stuff is, that was I mean, what the fuck was that guy thinking when he went to the inauguration? That's who he is. You know, he said he was cold. Yeah, he said he was cold. I mean, everybody else is in a nice overcoat is they've got leather gloves. What I will say, I mean, I'm not a Bernie fan. But he did do something nice. He ended up putting the meme on a T shirt. And I knew that he made a bunch of money and donated it to somebody and they ended up donating it right away and I kept no outdates pretty guys are wrong. they donate it and then they evenly disperse it to everybody. That's what they do. Except you know, people that actually have money. So you can set people have six vacation homes and stuff like that those people so he got none of it. Yeah, that's Ernie. I mean, Uncle Burleigh. plot them on that if you know if he did some nice weather, that's cool. Absolutely distributed. They also I like somebody that has a little self effacing humor, you know, he could laugh at himself. That's great. Yeah, absolutely. You talk about a secret to success is being able to laugh at yourself. That's you. Yeah. If you can get trolled on the internet, and you know, recognize that like, Hey, I kind of fucked this up. Right, but right now it's a big thing. I don't think he fucked it up. I only thought about it that way to be honest. Oh, I don't think he thinks he fucked it up at all. Okay, that's just true. That's exactly who he is. That's awesome. So Bernie, Bernie memes current topics. So I Want to know a little bit about, you know, your operation here? Because it seems like you guys got systems in play right? A little bit. And I think that's a big success to your business. It is right. And I noticed with the water vessels and you know, having people sign waivers and stuff like that, I mean, talk a little bit about systems. I mean, did you did you kind of implement those? Did those kind of come down top bottom? Or is it kind of a team effort? Well, systems come from a couple different things, they come one for efficiency, two for consistency of product. So you want to make sure that everybody gets the same experience, if you don't tell us, you know, give somebody adequate instruction on how to operate that boat, then they're not going to have fun. So that's a part of it. A lot of our systems paperwork and stuff comes unfortunately, from litigation. I was just in a meet my all morning, I was in a meeting with a group of guys from all over a boat round companies in California, but a few from Nevada, on creating standards, standards for Best Management Practices for people in our industry. So we want to make sure that we're all doing the same thing. But yeah, systems come from a lot of different places, and from a lot of different motivations, but they are super important. And the most important system is starting with training. You've got to train your people so that they're delivering a consistent product and doing everything the same way. For sure. Yeah, the the robotics of it. I mean, it's the least sexy portion of it by far. But it's the part that keeps you with a job. Absolutely. It keeps your doors open. Absolutely. And most of those like rules, and those systems only come after shipwrecks. Right? You know, nobody's like pre thinking a lot of this stuff that only happens, right? wheels fall. Right? Right? Well, I tell you what, when I started way back when lucilla wasn't dinosaurs, he likes to say, yeah, I think they're dinosaurs. And to literally, you would come into the office, you know, what do I need, you need a credit card, other than and actually, you could probably do with cash even but so you come in, you fall out a half of a sheet, so of four and a half by eight by four and a half sheet. Sure, sign your name on it. And then you go down on the dock, the guy turns on the key and says, Go have a nice day. Yeah, I mean, our process now it is easier to buy a gun in the state of California, less paperwork than it takes to rent a boat. And I'm not exaggerating. I mean, it is a very paperwork, intensive process, because of this own and that and all that stuff, trial and error. So how funny is it? Because I know me and Steve talked about this a lot. How odd is it when somebody comes up and wants to rent something but doesn't have a credit card? It's pretty odd, although it was less odd this summer, various less. That's a funny thing we never have been for years. I mean, who doesn't have a credit card, right? But we switched our models. So it doesn't even work that way. You have to reserve everything right now. You can't walk in anymore. It everything has to be reserved. So everything is by credit card. And you know, I just I feel better. But no, that's almost a I mean, I don't want to say that's a booking topic question. But your your booking software doesn't enforce credit card or debit card. Correct? Which I mean, I realized why they don't. But I also think that if you're a rental operator, that's a flaw in the matrix. And because we're in the business of driving online, bookings over the phone, bookings everything else, when you're just taking a credit card number over the phone, or somebody entering it in on their computer, you have no idea if they're renting with a valid credit card or a debit card, or if it's a stolen credit card, which, you know, I had, we've had a few of those $700 worth of chargebacks in the last week. Yeah. And we verified but yeah, so there's all kinds of perils, but bring that up in your call coming up? Yeah, that's, uh, that's, I mean, that's a real issue of like, how is there not a must force, credit card, non debit card type of thing? Well, even I mean, there's got to be a better way to validate the credentials than not is that not a thing. I mean, we just kind of like, so from the booking system, you don't have to, you can book with a credit card, you could book with a debit card you got from Target. I mean, you keep up with anything pre AP prepaid visa, there's no forced credit card. And the problem is is like if you're Joe Blow booking a jetski for from Seaforth over the internet, you can book that and then you're going to come in and expect to be able to take that jetski but if you don't have a valid credit card, now what the fuck? So the other way that's also a business decision you have to make, right? So if you have a, what's your cancellation policy, our cancellation policy is three days you can cancel for 100% refund within three days. I would love to make that a week. But if you make it a week, then you're going to reduce the number of people that work. So we used to have you know, you come in there was $1,000 credit card deposit authorization on your credit card. Now, if I did that I would greatly, particularly last summer, I would hugely reduce the number of people that are renting, that's when I made a business decision, or should make it more accessible. And while I did lose, because I didn't have that $1,000 I made it up by having more rentals. So, you know, again, it's a decision that you have a coin flip, it's a quarter, so this year with the COVID policies in place, and like the hotels and airlines and all that stuff, you made a, you know, pretty a cancellation, no cancellations, or anything like that, right? We kind of we held to the same to the three day cancellation. So that we did we did now with COVID stuff. If we when we were when we were not able to deliver because of COVID 100% refund for everybody. We didn't give them credits, we didn't give them gift cards, we refunded their money that was beyond what they could do. I look around again, you got to look at your reputation. It wasn't their fault. It's my problem. I'm in business, not them. So if I was going to ask you the closest without going over, what is the last day you think that you're going to have to be required by law to wear a mask? I would say 2023 Wow. Yeah. You're on the over over. Over. You're going out there. Yeah, I think that Yeah, I that this this shit ain't going away anytime fast. Do you think they're gonna make us work last forever? I do. I do. I mean, I don't want to say you're wrong. Because what the fuck do I know? Right? Well, I don't know, either. I mean, there's some data, my ass but i just i want to think that you think it's going to be implied that your staff and you guys have to wear masks till 2023 that's going to be a policy? I kind of think it is. So if you would have asked me the same question four weeks ago, or even two months ago, right? My hard number would have been like, August, September. Okay. And now we're post inauguration. It's an entirely democratic color and everything. I don't know if it's this year, but I think it's like February 2022. Maybe? I don't know. Yeah, I might say we're not so far off. I mean, I'm just adding a little bit to the Yeah. Yeah, that's I mean, I hate wearing a mask. I hate wearing a mask too. But yeah, you know, I mean of all the inconveniences I find that to be the least not going to a restaurant that is a good guy Sure. That's a California but but then but then go into that point on the mask Okay, then when does it where they open restaurants right? And then you take your mask off to eat and drink. You see I know it's kind of you know, what do you know our tiered program in California? So yes to a point but so the the absurdity is it starts the most severe is the purple tier. And then it goes to the red tier, the yellow tier and then the chartreuse I don't know what the fuck and then it's a free for all so but that's the absurdity like that's how these people think were in any color scheme in the history of the world. When was it red is the worst a green is the best but we go purple Red Yellow where the fuck have they come up with that? How is that in any way intuitive can go with anything I mean, not trying to get into politics and go deep into it but no fucking shit Where did that color scheme like you should have things that are intuitive. I gotta go look up but purple. Is that better than searchers? Like I don't know what color I think we used to drink that in college. That was like a cocktail or you sat differently isn't a charcuterie. I don't say that word. I can't say that word. Everybody loves it. Everybody loves a tray. No, I don't even try like are you like meat and cheese trays? Who doesn't like a meat? Yeah, I think I think charcuterie boards were the fucking the thing of 2022 people start making about their house, you know, banana bread that just my daughter brought one over for Christmas and it was like in the shape of a holy fuck. How long does it take you to do that? They try and eat it and they all slapped a cuz it's not ready to like, it's such a basic. I mean, I don't want to say basic white girl shit. But where the fuck did I mean? I learned a little Smokies ago. Yeah, we're little Smokies go what happened to buying it normal meat and cheese dread fucking Walmart or Costco. Now it has to be cutting like fucking weird, dry air and fucking you know it clearly you're not going to barbarella because they have a hell of a nice charcuterie board. And like I thought you had a little bit more class. I forgot. Vegas. You know? It's class. That was a great thing. I love a good meat and cheese board. But man, I just think it's such a but you're more of a Hormel guy. I get it. No. We discuss that. Okay, let's talk at this or empty more. What's the day? What is the most what's the most what is the one thing that's always in your house? That's always in your pantry right? And like if you run out of it, you know that there's still always gonna be there. What is that bourbon? Okay, we're talking food items. Oh, food items. Is that dense? a more generic ramen. There's always wrong. We would probably be we really don't have a lot of food in our house. It's probably gonna be like a low carb tortilla. It's pretty okay, so because I you know, I have a 17 year old boy in our house. I have I had no idea I was gonna end up buying as much mac and cheese. And I mean, our house looks like it is straight. We've got like mozzarella sticks, pizza rolls. I mean, we're basically like our like a shitty appetizer sampler away from from like real food. I was over at Steve's house and you know most people go to Costco and even if they're buying kids I got kids like 18 boxes of macaroni and cheese Steve had two boxes of 18 sets and a lot of fucking mac and cheese that is you might you might did they not have like Bristol farms in in Vegas because there's there's you could up your game here a little bit. Now. We're not. We're not we're not busting out the big dollars here for the 17 year old kids. You're saying he doesn't eat charcuterie boards? Yeah. with normal you know what he probably actually does. He you know he has great taste he loves like you know he wants all the nice chef so he just he just has mac and cheese budget so dad just a man know that feeds him the mac and cheese we keep them you keep them welfare. You go so he'll he'll feel real comfortable when he goes to college that he's Yeah, I mean, that's what I eat through college. Yeah, we don't need that. What's your what's your what's your take on spam? See, I like spam. Um, but I also you know, spam and like fried rice. I can. I can do the whole Hawaiian thing. I'm not opposed to it like spam. That's a big name. I think I grew up on spam. Honestly. Yeah. Hawaiian agency. You're no No, no, no on the spam. Okay. On the spam Yeah, yeah, I like wine food. I don't mind spam. I don't eat it out of a can or nothing. Like the only the only thing if you don't eat it out of a kid. You don't eat at that restaurant. If it's cooked. Oh, you know what I mean? Like, to me, I'm so prepared. Spam. Likes fancy spam. Fancy spam. Yes. It was a lot of money for spam by the guy in the back. Okay. Yeah, yeah, the only thing I'm weirded out about is so like my grandpa used to eat those like Vienna sausages. Yeah, they're fucking gross. Oh, yeah. God, they are like, that is some disgusting as food. How that ever became a thing of like, you know what? Try these little fucking non. No, no. Life's too short for Vienna sausages. I'm just saying. Yeah, that's that's funny. So were you were you speaking Now speaking of food, I kind of was thinking of some fishing or whatever because you guys do fit. Are you an avid fishermen around here? You know I have fished my whole life. I love to fish I'll go fishing with my son. But you know I have last couple years I just haven't devoted the time to it. It's a big commitment. Like I don't play golf for the same reason like you can't go and play golf for two hours. Right? It's a day commitment. And and I find that to spend the whole day fishing. Unless there's a really good reason. I don't do it so much but I love fishing analogy about the golf in the fit. I mean, think you can go play golf for a little bit not all day, but I get the analogy that horrible. Yeah, what's your hobby? I can try I'm not good. Yeah, I mean, I golf like I fish Well, well, right. I mean, you know, I mean, I think it takes somebody invites me out golfing. I'll go hit a golf club. There you go. Yeah, golf is better if you're good at it. You know what I mean? Right It's fun. It's fun. It's the most fun most fun if you're if you're better what's your hobby? What's your go to like boating well we'll go boating won't go on you know anything in boats will go powerboat sailboat will jetski whatever it is, we wherever we go in the world. We will be on a boat wherever whenever we have an A that was Nothing's going on. we'll hop on it. And that's always been a family thing. It's always been a family thing that's growing up my kids. I mean, literally a week when they were a week old. Each of my kids were on a boat. Do you have like a certain route that you love? Or do you just go we did there's a couple different like routes that we'll do you know, there's like, we're have people from out of town. So there's like a standard cruise in in San Diego Bay. And now my kids are older. So most of the time the route will be to the yacht club where you get a cocktail because that's also one of my habits but are one of my hobbies but it really sounds horrible to say that like getting drunk is a hobby but you know, it is what it is. Was it it just that's what it is. Sounds like a fun route to go on. Yeah, so so on that destination side of things. Where have you where's the farthest you've gone on a boat and destination wise. farthest I've gone on a boat would be the The Sea of Cortez okay so we went all the way down past Cabo and up into the Sea of Cortez I was on like a cruise ship or no no I mean on a cruise ship I've been other places this was on with a friend on his boat I helped him power sail powerboat. powerbomb boat. Do you like sailing? I do. My wife is not a sailor. It's too slow. So you know my son likes to say I will go and do it sometimes but most of the time we're on powerboat Yeah, I'm so I asked us and I get you're not a sailor. But I guess I'm going to ask a question you because we asked it earlier today. Coming into San Diego, you know, if you come from the Midwest, nobody knows shit about sailing, right? Mostly because there's lack of huge bodies of water to go sailing in. So you come out here and you see the marinas just full of sailboats. Does that passion for sailing? Is that carried over to a younger generation? Like it should be? Or do kids not see the passion? Is that like an old old timer type of thing? Well, I go to these to these conventions where we have industry people that talk about boating, you know, Marina operators, right. And one of the big concerns they have is aging out on on people getting into boating. That's why from like the National Marine Manufacturers Association, and other people were super important. Boat rental companies are super important because we were the gateway drug, right? Yeah, if you get these kids on a boat, you get them sailing, then you can get it. But I think that there is a challenge to that. I think, you know, baseball, right? Right, if you don't start youth baseball, but the owning a boat is is a different thing. You know, I think, you know, this whole millennial thing. They don't want to have a commitment. So if people are less likely younger people now are less likely to buy a boat than they were in the past. Well, I think you know, because again, I've got a 17 year old at home. I mean, I've got a wakeboard boat, we go out and he loves sure, but there's never been an itch to like, you know what, I'd love to do go out sailing dad. He'll, he'll happily get on a jetski. You know, go he'll go tear up how long he loves the wakeboard boat. But I expressively think about the sailing side of it. Because I think it's interesting. But I don't know that I'm so compelled that I would want to go buy a sailboat. So I remember we were saying there's things there's areas that I was going to talk about with my buddy in the podcast. Yeah, really close to that. Just not gonna go. I love that. That's cool. That's cool. We have no problem with keep keeping it going with that. No, no. Okay. That's right. That's like, but uh, yeah, so that's, that's, that's awesome to hear. So when we were when we were down here, I think the first the first time you you see expansion of but also being expansion just in San Diego, you you kind of you believe in that that theory, not necessarily expansion in like multiple destination areas. I in terms of us being the operator, like Steven, I've talked about, you know, maybe looking at ways that we can help promote other companies or build our model. Like, I think our model is phenomenal. And I think that that does translate somewhere else. And I think for me, you know, again, we were getting back to the retirement thing. That would be a great challenge. Like I've done this, like I have always tried to reinvent our business, I've tried to do different things. So you don't go crazy after doing the same thing for all those years. But that, to me is a challenge. That really would be a lot of fun. And I think it does play well in another market. So yeah, so so so on on that. I mean, I guess so you're kind of looking at it, like what was your your thoughts about otas? But do you want to maybe look at being your own otas? Or in a sense, right to help other people expand and sell their own tours, yes, but beyond being an otaa, like, sort of like with a consultant side to it. So this is how you do it. This is what we help you sell your product, but this is how you refine your product. And this is how you develop your product. The rental business has such a challenging barrier of entry. I mean, just because of equipment, right? I mean, you know, and that's right. And a lot of it is challenging equipment to finance in quantity, right, you can go buy a boat, it's a lot harder to buy 10 boats, right. And so yeah, that's a you know, that's even our challenge. We find it you know, you go buy jet skis. It's like you go start with one you can go buy two jet skis No problem, right. How do you buy a dozen right and I heard you I heard you say that that's that was actually a topic for watersports guys is what what you buy new fleets every year. Right? turnover ratio like I mean we so we we have weathered a few storms over the years. And we went through the oh eight timeframe, which actually when I had a partner that I would didn't talk about earlier, but I bought out my partner in the timeframe. So I was pretty well. Debt Laden. Sure, and everything went to crap. So normally my normal renewal schedule got pushed off by several years, and I'm still recovering from that. But this year, I just made a huge investment. I bought a bunch of boats and we're getting back into that but you need To refresh on a regular basis, jet skis, maybe maybe if you're lucky, you can go three years. But that's the max. But yeah, then they just have so many hours. And they've just been through hell, right? Because Yeah, I think there was kind of a both sides about that from the rental side of, you know, trying to get your three years or is that harder to do? You know, I mean, in money making side, yeah, it's a tough thing. And I do, you know, I do that spreadsheet 10 different ways to Sunday like, and basically I look at like, okay, a piece of equipment cost $10,000, I can sell it in five years for $5,000. Further, you know, some math, so it cost you 1000 bucks a year. But if I could buy that for $10,000, and sell it in a year for $9,000, then it's that same $1,000. But I have fresh equipment every year, you and I spoke to the same manufacturer and had that same bullshit conversation. And it sounds so much easier on paper, than I think it is actually just rotating the inventory like that. Yes. But it sounds great. In theory, Yeah, it does. In theory, it's like a crush it you're gonna be like new new equipment every year. Right? Right. But we also pay seven and three quarter percent sales tax on everything that we buy. So you know, you've got to factor that into your expand what other other like other taxes and stuff like that in California of doing business, what other people may not know of? Like, is there anything that's kind of so it's an interesting business model in that wherever you're operating out of you were operating not on land that you own in California, you're operating either, and the land that's sub leased or leased from the city of San Diego, the Port of San Diego, the city of cornado. And these municipalities charge you your rent based on a percentage of your gross. So they take you take a big haircut right out of the gate. And that's that makes it a tough way to do business. And that's everybody that's based anybody that's, whether it's the Hyatt, the Marriott, or it's us. And the other part of that is it makes you very top line driven. So it's important, like, if you want to renew your lease, you got to be super top line driven. If you're not, if I'm like I could cut, I could kill my margins, you know, increase my margins. But it would reduce my gross, I can't do that, because I got to make sure that my landlords are happy that I'm paying them a bunch of money. So it's a funny anomaly that, you know, normally you're in business, you care about the bottom line, who cares? What you know, I'm running a $50 million. I don't care about that. But here, I do have to worry about that top one as well. So that that's the most significant that and that's an interesting, that's an interesting. Yeah, I've never heard any other place that does it like that. Do you know of any other? I mean, is that like a normal California thing? I think it's a normal California thing. I mean, I mean, that just creates more friction that you can get in the space. Yeah. Yeah. If everybody that's kind of doing business or trying to rent any sort of land on a, on a marina, if they're getting taxed out, they're asked based on the revenues, right. And you're also faced, so then you have it's easy pickings for the guys that are not following the rules that go to the lawn tramp and rent their boat out of there. Because they're automatically you know, 10 15% lower in their expenses with no brick and mortar. So we can't have the brick and mortar brick and mortar expense, you get your percentage expenses, and they're kind of backdoor and new and running, you know, illegally, but there's, but that is such a pain in the ass. I mean, you know, we're based in Vegas, and there's only one rental operator on the water. And everybody else has to pull out to the water, right? I mean, you can have it No, no, I, I thought about it when you're like, I was gonna take the inventory that I was gonna sell. Right? Yeah. And I was gonna start trailing and put it on a trailer. And I thought about that for about an hour. And I'm like, there's no way because you could Oh, absolutely. Because so you do that. And the guy comes back after two days, because he took it to Lake Havasu. And he's like, I got it out there. And it never worked. I don't want to pay for the two days. Yeah, so you didn't have the opportunity to rectify it. You didn't have the opportunity to rent it to somebody else. I'm like, now I'm not gonna say I've never had that phone call. Yeah, I am sure that you have. There's a lot of rocks in the middle of the desert. Yeah, these jet skis do a good job of sucking them all. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's a learning curve that I never ever thought I was going to have to learn. And I'm in it now. And it's good. And I can see like light at the end of the tunnel. But man that hindsight, hindsight, you probably wouldn't have approached things the same way. You know what, I have a great sign. I forget where we were, but I just took a picture of this sign. It's like, no refunds. No, no, it was we rented we rented quads in the desert. Yeah. And so in the in their their in their agreement was if it breaks, you bought it if it breaks your it's your responsibility. We don't reschedule if you're late you pay like all the things that I would love to say but i a little bit more customer service oriented. And I think that you could probably pull it off. I'm just saying So, talking to that point, because you're being a jetski operator, at first, it was such a rub, because, you know, you send out a jetski. And it would come back, and like the wearing would be shot, right impeller would be like chewed up, right and, or, you know, or pick your damage, but those are bigger ones. And it and I mean, so I have to say you have to almost throw reviews to the wind. You you can't you can't be concerned about your reviews. But it almost became another profit center. Because these people would bring them back and I was like, okay, you need to wearing wearing $300. Right. But you feel like a different operator when you spent your entire like other business really concerned about reviews. And now you're telling people like Sorry, bro, kick rocks, you owe us? $300? Right? Yeah, we didn't do anything. And they charged us and they never told us such and then they disputed on their credit card anyway, so and they still leave you the review. Oh, here we were talking about crazy stories. Here's a crazy story. It's a little bit off color. But yeah, that's where we're at. So we had a horrible tragic event like this is not this is not a laughing matter. But over the summer, we had a large homeless population that was living near my location in downtown San Diego. So we had a homeless guy who's actually a veteran who climbs up on the wall of the riprap of the marina the rocks, which was like, I don't know, four feet high, and dives into the rocks and ends up perishing like this is there's no funny Oh my god. I mean, it's just horrible. But my my manager, there was a former military also, and very well trained was a military medic, he and the crew pulled people out of the water, pull the man out of the water, they give them CPR, they were actually able to revive him. We got him transported the hospital and again, unfortunately, he did perish at the hospital. But I mean, I think they did a remarkable job. They got everybody out of the way. I mean, they handled it in that like textbook the most professional way. They were, they were as good as possible to try and help this poor fella. We got a review from some asshole that said their trip was ruined. Because a guy tried to kill himself in front of them on the dock and my guys didn't do the good job doing CPR. Like where the fuck to these people come off with the HUD a thing? that that that actually is chapter one of my book, the most absurd crazy thing that can ever happen with the experience was horrible. But these people who the fuck really you care your trip got ruined? And and it's my fault. Because someday our guy you know, couldn't deal with life anymore. Yeah, sanity. That's the I mean, we see those customers too. And sometimes you see those reviews and it takes all of you to not dial him up and ask him like, what the fuck exactly? I think I doubt you and said, Could you call them and he called me up and said, Steve, what the fuck? Yeah. But yeah, these dudes are customer. The customers not always right. No, no. And and we're not always right. You know, there's that's life. Right. But it was life. Whatever. That's that is funny that we should do a segment with the tour operators read their words, they read their lowest reviews that they get because we talked about that too, with our with our ATV guy. And sometimes reviews like they'll say, Oh, the ATVs weren't fast enough. It's like we know that you know what I mean? Like sometimes those bad reviews understand what your business but stuff like that out of control is just completely right. It'd be like that. What's that episode on like Jimmy Kimmel or Fallon, where he's like, the bad tweets that we have Andy have to read it bad reviews. And he's gonna be like, what the write them? And you know, and sometimes the reviews are bad. You know, I mean, we had some personnel issues and our staff wasn't as friendly and you got to eat that, you know, I mean, what are you gonna do to fix it? And then you and then you got to fix you know, you prove that, you know, I mean, it's people had a bad experience, you know, and if it was something that you guys did, you guys can fix it right here. It's one thing Yeah, it's one thing if it's an internal problem, and it calls attention to it. It's another thing when it's just absurdity. And you're like, well, that there was no wind. I rented a sailboat there was no wind. I'm like, Okay, I know that I am godlike, but I am not God and I do not cause the wind to blow. So before we wrap this up, I'm going to ask you, I got one more question. Have you ever seen a blue whale or a whale come up and land on a boat? I have never seen a whale land on a boat. Do you think Have you seen that meme? Or that video? Where the blue whale came up and landed on the people's kayak or their sailboat or whatever? I'm gonna say it's fake. You think it's fake? Its fake. What the fuck? They're smart animals. They're way smarter than us. Like they know what the fuck is going on. Like I think it's made up shit. Okay, burning on the other hand real real like that's it's real. But I don't think the whales are jumping up anybody's boat. That Because we we don't think you could Photoshop that. I mean, because it's like a video like how are you making that? But I mean, I guess we're in California, right Hollywood? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, we could do anything. So on that note yeah on that note if you guys have not been check it out Seaforth boat rental.com you guys can rent boats experiences, charters, tours, sailing everything from jet skis. Check it out. See fourth boat rental. Check out the locations when you guys are in San Diego from Coronado downtown harbor Island Mission Bay. Check them out. They're great people down here, Andy. Thank you guys for having me. Thanks to you guys. Staff. It was awesome. Absolutely. And I barely got into any c story. So people come by and they want to hear some of my 40 years of waterfront wisdom. I will throw it right out of just single malt. The title of your book 40 years of waterfront wisdom, I like it. I am I'm gonna start Sure. Yeah. Should I reserve that? That's a good one. Would you write the book yourself? Or would you use one of those? What is it a ghostwriter goes on? Do I seem like a guy that is going to delegate my memoirs? I don't think so. I just I don't know if you're a good writer. Of course I am. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, guys, for listening to that podcast. Jaden with the AMP agency. Veteran activity marketing pros. We're out of here. See you guys later. Bye, guys.